![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
luzulaEr, this is possibly the geekiest thing I have ever done.
A while ago I posted a snippet with the due South pilot told in the style of Tolkien's Silmarillion. And now I have translated it to Quenya. Yes, I actually spent a summer about ten years ago learning Quenya, although I had to look up most of the vocabulary and grammar again to do this. Thanks to fellow geekbghost for taking a look at the translation!
Hmm, I wonder why there is no fic in Quenya on the AO3 already? I sent a support request asking them to add it as a language so I could list this as a translation, which they said they'd do. But I'd have expected someone who actually writes in Tolkien fandom to have done it before this. Also, I'm totally going to podfic this just so that the audiofic archive can have a tag for Quenya. *g*
I learned Quenya from the course on this site, which is ugly but informative. I translated the names in the snippet into Quenya, since they contain sound combinations which don't work for that language. Name translations are from this site, except for Chicago. I googled that as potentially meaning something like "stinky-place" (heh) and translated it as Holwenomë (holwë=stink, nomë=place).
Robert = Alcarcalimo
Benton (= Benjamin) = Hyarion
Ray = Alcon
Elizabeth = Eruvandë
***
Lúmissë Eruvandë Attëo ulki neri hastaner Formenorë. Oloiyanentë parca nór ar sahtanentë lië marentallon, pan i neri milci ar merner laurë. Er ner mahtanet, Alcarcalimo arnë tirnaron, ar meldorya cítaina vartanes ar nwalcavë nahtanes va cana.
Mal i nahtanë arna tirnava ná atacarna illumë, ar yondorya Hyarion vandanë hirë i nehtari, ananta lelyuvas palan. I nehtari úmer maisi sé lelyalë rávassë, ar Hyarion as ráca otornoryë roitanes ú taryassëo.
Linauressen ar lillomessen hilyanentet hyarmenna, tenna tullente minassë Holwenomessë, ya ná hyarmen lá marenta.
Írë Hyarion tullë Holwenomessë colles carnë vacco arnë tirnaron, ya úmë senwa i nossin nomëo tana, pan núror tario umir tulë rimbavë tar. Né minassë alta ar ettelëa, ar Hyarion né har avánië estelerya. Mal i ettelëa nóresse neri mani er enger, ar Hyarion omentanë ner minassë tirnaron, estanë Alcon, ya manyas.
Alcon maiti Holwenomessë sívë Hyarion rávassë, ar hirnentë i nehtar rato. Mal nés er carma hyëon, ar Hyarion parnë as nyérë sa engë neri raicar yando arnë tirnaron.
Hyarion umë quildë ar quentë palan neri raicaron, ar arnë tirnar paimetanes. Nés etelenda ar lemyane minassë hyarmenyassë tana, vahaia mareryallo Formenoressë.
***
Here's a literal word-for-word translation to English. I indicated the case endings by just sticking the prepositions on the end, and the pronoun suffixes by just sticking the pronoun on the end.
Time-in Elizabeth Second-of evil men marred North-lands. Flooded-they dry land and forced-they people homes-their-from, for the men greedy and wanted gold. One man fought-them, Robert royal guard-of, and friend-his supposed betrayed-him and cruelly slew-him from behind.
But the slaying royal guard-of is avenged always, and son-his Benton pledged to find the slayers, although travel-would-he far. The slayers were-not skilled at traveling wilderness-in, and Benton with wolf sworn-brother-his hunted-them without difficulty.
Many-days-in and many-nights-in followed-they-them south-towards, until came-they stronghold Chicago-in, which is south beyond home-their.
When Benton came Chicago-in wore-he red coat royal guard-of, which was-not usual the people-to place-of that, because servants queen-of did-not come often thither. Was stronghold great and strange, and Benton was near losing hope-his. But the strange land-in men good still existed, and Benton met man city guard-of, named Ray, who helped him.
Ray skilled Chicago-in as Benton wilderness-in, and found-they killer soon. But was-he only tool other-person-of, and Benton learned with sorrow that existed men crooked also royal guard-of.
Benton was-not quiet and told far-and-wide men crooked-of, and royal guard punished-him. Was-he exiled and remained stronghold southern-in that, far-away home-his-from North-land-in.
A while ago I posted a snippet with the due South pilot told in the style of Tolkien's Silmarillion. And now I have translated it to Quenya. Yes, I actually spent a summer about ten years ago learning Quenya, although I had to look up most of the vocabulary and grammar again to do this. Thanks to fellow geek
bghost for taking a look at the translation! Hmm, I wonder why there is no fic in Quenya on the AO3 already? I sent a support request asking them to add it as a language so I could list this as a translation, which they said they'd do. But I'd have expected someone who actually writes in Tolkien fandom to have done it before this. Also, I'm totally going to podfic this just so that the audiofic archive can have a tag for Quenya. *g*
I learned Quenya from the course on this site, which is ugly but informative. I translated the names in the snippet into Quenya, since they contain sound combinations which don't work for that language. Name translations are from this site, except for Chicago. I googled that as potentially meaning something like "stinky-place" (heh) and translated it as Holwenomë (holwë=stink, nomë=place).
Robert = Alcarcalimo
Benton (= Benjamin) = Hyarion
Ray = Alcon
Elizabeth = Eruvandë
***
Lúmissë Eruvandë Attëo ulki neri hastaner Formenorë. Oloiyanentë parca nór ar sahtanentë lië marentallon, pan i neri milci ar merner laurë. Er ner mahtanet, Alcarcalimo arnë tirnaron, ar meldorya cítaina vartanes ar nwalcavë nahtanes va cana.
Mal i nahtanë arna tirnava ná atacarna illumë, ar yondorya Hyarion vandanë hirë i nehtari, ananta lelyuvas palan. I nehtari úmer maisi sé lelyalë rávassë, ar Hyarion as ráca otornoryë roitanes ú taryassëo.
Linauressen ar lillomessen hilyanentet hyarmenna, tenna tullente minassë Holwenomessë, ya ná hyarmen lá marenta.
Írë Hyarion tullë Holwenomessë colles carnë vacco arnë tirnaron, ya úmë senwa i nossin nomëo tana, pan núror tario umir tulë rimbavë tar. Né minassë alta ar ettelëa, ar Hyarion né har avánië estelerya. Mal i ettelëa nóresse neri mani er enger, ar Hyarion omentanë ner minassë tirnaron, estanë Alcon, ya manyas.
Alcon maiti Holwenomessë sívë Hyarion rávassë, ar hirnentë i nehtar rato. Mal nés er carma hyëon, ar Hyarion parnë as nyérë sa engë neri raicar yando arnë tirnaron.
Hyarion umë quildë ar quentë palan neri raicaron, ar arnë tirnar paimetanes. Nés etelenda ar lemyane minassë hyarmenyassë tana, vahaia mareryallo Formenoressë.
***
Here's a literal word-for-word translation to English. I indicated the case endings by just sticking the prepositions on the end, and the pronoun suffixes by just sticking the pronoun on the end.
Time-in Elizabeth Second-of evil men marred North-lands. Flooded-they dry land and forced-they people homes-their-from, for the men greedy and wanted gold. One man fought-them, Robert royal guard-of, and friend-his supposed betrayed-him and cruelly slew-him from behind.
But the slaying royal guard-of is avenged always, and son-his Benton pledged to find the slayers, although travel-would-he far. The slayers were-not skilled at traveling wilderness-in, and Benton with wolf sworn-brother-his hunted-them without difficulty.
Many-days-in and many-nights-in followed-they-them south-towards, until came-they stronghold Chicago-in, which is south beyond home-their.
When Benton came Chicago-in wore-he red coat royal guard-of, which was-not usual the people-to place-of that, because servants queen-of did-not come often thither. Was stronghold great and strange, and Benton was near losing hope-his. But the strange land-in men good still existed, and Benton met man city guard-of, named Ray, who helped him.
Ray skilled Chicago-in as Benton wilderness-in, and found-they killer soon. But was-he only tool other-person-of, and Benton learned with sorrow that existed men crooked also royal guard-of.
Benton was-not quiet and told far-and-wide men crooked-of, and royal guard punished-him. Was-he exiled and remained stronghold southern-in that, far-away home-his-from North-land-in.
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 08:14 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 09:28 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 09:01 pm (UTC)WHEN ARE YOU POSTING THE PODFIC WHEN WHEN WHEN?
PS: I'm sure there's fic in Quenya out there somewhere? I'm less surprised there's none on AO3; I suspect it's too young an archive yet.
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 09:47 pm (UTC)Although I have to scold you a little for linking to that course -- I almost didn't backbutton in time D:
Because the site design made your eyes bleed, or because you almost got sucked in by the course? *g* The course is available as pdf, with no weird colors, if you're interested.
Podfic, hmm. Hopefully before the end of the year? : )
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 09:25 am (UTC)I'm definitely looking forward to the podfic.
Geeky question: the verbs don't have personal endings? I'm just curious because I initially took the ë to mean 'they', but I see it all over in what I take to be the verbs. Then you put "he fought-them", which must be mahtanet? So -t would 3rd person singular? But them is object. And part of the verb...? GDI someone take this post away from me /o\
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 09:54 am (UTC)they forced = sahtanentë = oloiya + ne + ntë
where "-ntë" is the subject "they", and
they followed them = hilyanentet = hilya + ne + nte + t
where the last "-t" is "them". Also, in the absence of pronoun suffixes, the verbs should agree in number with the noun, so in the first sentence we have "hastaner" with the plural marker "-r" rather than just "hastanë" (there's also a dual marker).
*evil enabling laugh*
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 10:07 am (UTC)Subject AND object endings! So [stem + tense + subject + object] unless explicit subject in noun/ proprium in which case... plural marker. That last bit seems a bit excessive, hum... (There's a dual but not a singular? Are there not first person singular personal pronouns so you only mark it as a subject suffix/infix? Or were you just trying to scare me by emphasizing the dual? *g*)
Gyyyaaah! I maintain that learning new languages is healthy and good for the brain! That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 02:25 pm (UTC)they forced = sahtanentë = oloiya + ne + ntë
should have been like this:
they forced = sahtanentë = sahta + ne + ntë
but I'm sure that was obvious. *facepalm* I went back and changed the example but forgot to change a bit of it.
Anyway. In the singular you don't do anything to the verb--there's no specific marker for it. (And checking more carefully, it's apparently not settled yet whether there's a dual marker for the verb, sorry! There's a dual plural form for nouns, but no evidence either way for the verb. Apparently there's a whole bunch of Tolkien's notes which haven't been published yet. Anyway, the dual form isn't that common.)
Yes, there are also independent pronouns. "I love you", for example, could be written in several different ways:
mélanyel
ni mélalyë
ni tyë-méla
inyë tyë-méla
Er, yeah. Apparently independent pronouns are used mostly used when you want to be emphatic (and there are also extra emphatic independent pronouns--"ni" versus "inyë"). Also, there's a polite/familiar distinction in the second person. Plus there are various obscurities due to the fact that Tolkien probably changed his mind a couple of times.
Curse you, I was supposed to work now! This stuff just sucks you in. *shakes head*
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 02:39 pm (UTC)Yes, I caught the minor mistake :o)
Singular = no mark makes total sense. (I wouldn't be surprised if Tolkien had included a dual verb form; it certainly seems to fit with the overall style of the language.)
It's all so interesting! The polite/familiar distinction is so useful, I think, and I like the thought of how such a form would change the meaning and connotations of "I love you" -- now I'm curious to know whether he had any specific thoughts wrt semantics for this language, because of course this example reminded me of agape/eros/storge.
I'm sorry! But I think it's entirely fair to say that you started it! ;o)
PS: I just came by this post on tumblr, which amused me greatly.
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 04:36 pm (UTC)Yeah, the verb for love that I used doesn't have sexual overtones, I think--there's a separate word for that, at least.
*checks out tumblr post*
So, in Quenya: "Can I touch your butt? = "Ma lertan appa pontelya?"
("Pontë" may just mean the entire backside of your body rather than butt, though.)
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 06:11 pm (UTC)I'm delighted there's at least that separation in meanings -- so cool!
You are so awesome! You know I think tumblr is the poorer for not yet knowing that? You don't have a tumblr so you could add that bit...? *g*
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:35 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:58 pm (UTC)I added it to the post. tumblr being tumblr it now remains to be seen whether that was a good idea :oP
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 09:02 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:37 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 09:23 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:38 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-16 11:59 pm (UTC)I kind of fail at languages because why can't people have the same rules for grammar everywhere?! So that you did this (in a totally made up language, just like Esperanto!) just amazes and delights me.
(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:39 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 12:56 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:43 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 10:30 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 01:33 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:44 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 04:01 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:44 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:06 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2012-12-17 07:45 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2013-01-13 09:58 pm (UTC)Thank you for sharing! ♥
(no subject)
Date: 2013-01-14 09:59 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2013-01-14 10:31 am (UTC)This is *amazing*.
(no subject)
Date: 2013-01-14 03:45 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2013-01-15 08:30 am (UTC)Any chance you'll be able to get these up on AO3?
(no subject)
Date: 2013-01-15 10:08 am (UTC)I'm putting the text on AO3, at least, but I'm waiting on them to add Quenya as a language, so I can list it as a translation. As for the podfic, I am planning on putting all my podfic up there in the long term, but I'm waiting on getting separate media categories. They're supposed to post an updated roadmap soon, so hopefully I'll get an idea then on how long it's going to be.
(no subject)
Date: 2013-02-08 05:18 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2013-02-08 01:40 pm (UTC)