Rec me some SF & F?

[luzula]

I'm ordering a big batch of science fiction and fantasy books from Sweden's SF & F bookstore, and I need a few more books to get over the free freight limit. I'm getting the rest of Karen Traviss' "Wess'Har" series (annoyingly, part 2 is out of print and I had to order it second hand from the US). And I'm also probably getting Jo Walton's "Among Others". But I'd love some recs as to what else I should get!

I'm in the mood for:
- interesting female characters
- interesting world-building
- not sure how to phrase this, but: books that deal with political issues, or environmental issues. Or characters who want to do the right thing, or struggle with various allegiances.

I'm not in the mood for:
- books where the main plot is a romance
- epic high fantasy

but if you have something so good that it will transcend my mood, just rec it anyway!

Have not read Robin McKinley's various fairy tale rewritings and am curious about them. If you have opinions about them, please share!

Comments

[akamine_chan]

A Bait of Dreams by Jo Clayton. Jo was one of my favorite female writers and this story, while technically part of her Diadem series, is a stand-alone books that meet all of your requirements - strong female character, fascinating world building and characters who struggle with doing the right thing.

It might come off as a fantasy book, but it's fairly clear that it's sci-fi - one of the main characters is an offworlder and there are many alien races living on the planet.

Might be hard to find, though, it's been out-of-print for a number of years...*sadface*

Aaaand there is a romance, but it is definitely not the focus of the story.

[luzula]

Yeah, seems to be out of print, so not an option for buying in this batch. Thanks for the rec, though--it sounds interesting!

[malnpudl]

I love Tanya Huff's Confederation series -- the books with "Valor" in the titles -- and they most certainly meet your first two criteria. With a bit of the third, at least. The protagonist is a female sergeant in the Marines -- i.e., the infantry or ground troops -- which are composed from members of three of the species within the Confederation. Other species fulfill different roles.

Huff's writing is good rather than great, but her world-building is terrific and her storytelling is wonderful. In addition to the complete and satisfying plot within each book, there's also greater story arc threading through the entire series.

Another plus: Roles in this 'verse are entirely gender-neutral, which is a welcome breath of fresh air, doubly so because Huff doesn't call attention to it. Sexuality is also flexible. And fun. *g*

[luzula]

That does sound like something I'd enjoy! Stories with female military officers tend to, um, appeal to my id for some reason.

I'll get the first one of those. : )

[innocentsmith]

Anything by Connie Willis, but especially:

Doomsday Book, wherein a near-future academic is sent back in time (by a relatively new time travel process) to study the medieval era, and she accidentally lands bang in the middle of a plague outbreak. This one is devastating, and not to be read when you're feeling depressed and/or sick, but so, so good. Everyone should read it.

To Say Nothing of the Dog, wherein the same time-travel-by-academics idea is used, but this time it's a fluffy, goofy romp as a loopy jetlagged time traveller is sent back to the late Victorian era on a vacation/search for a really ugly piece of art. Hijinks ensue. Has tons of Wodehousian plot twists, interesting discussion of how history should be approached, and some really charming animal characters.

Passage, a novel about a neuroscientist and a psychologist who have developed a way to artificially induce near-death experiences in order to try to figure out what they really are, and how this goes terribly wrong. Also, the Titanic. Really thinky and fascinating: starts slow, and reasonably light, but gets more and more tense and dark as it goes on.

I think you'd also really like Rosemary Kirstein's Steerswoman series. I'm just going to quote Wiki on this: It follows the journey of Rowen, who is a Steerswoman in an age that is just beginning to gain technology and advancement, though most don’t understand it and those who do hoard the knowledge amongst themselves. A Steerswoman (or Steersman, though far less frequently) is a traveling scholar looking to supplement as well as share their knowledge. They are required to answer any question put to them by anyone and in turn, any question they ask must be answered, or the questioner will be placed under a ban where no Steerswoman will ever answer a question from them again. There are two groups that commonly pay little attention to the Steerswoman’s ban, those being wizards, who refuse to share their magical secrets, and Outskirters, who, as their name suggests, live on the outskirts of civilization and aren’t really familiar with Steerswomen or their customs.

There's a practical and down-to-earth sense to the worldbuilding, and the knowledge that the Steerswomen gain, and lots of awesome women.

Also, anything by Octavia E. Butler, if you haven't already read her. I liked the Parable series and Kindred best, I think, but any of her stuff is well worth reading, and chock-full of feminist and political issues.

As for Robin McKinley, I've read pretty much everything she's ever written. ♥ her. For you, I think I'd recommend Spindle's End, which has absolutely lovely, fun worldbuilding and nicely avoids some annoying narrative traps of Disney-fied fairytales. And Deerskin, which is dark and deals with triggery content, but deals with it really well and in a way that affirms that survivors of abuse can regain their sense of self and go on to live their own lives. It's really excellent.

[luzula]

I've read and loved "Doomsday Book" (and also "Blackout" and "All Clear")! I started listening to "To Say Nothing of the Dog", but for whatever reason it didn't grab me. Maybe I wasn't in the mood for fluffy? My library has "Passage", so I'll try that one, since it seems I tend to like Willis' serious books better.

I've been curious about the "Steerswoman" series before! *makes note to get hold of them*

I've got the audiobook of Butler's "Parable of the Sower" and plan to listen to it soon. And yeah, I really ought to have read her before.

The only thing I've read by McKinley is "Sunshine", which I absolutely loved. I'll get one of the two you recced, then (none of which my library has, though they do have "Beauty").

[isis]

Vorkosigan Saga and/or the Chalion series by Bujold?

[luzula]

Haven't read them! Though I've seen them mentioned, obviously. My library seems to have the Chalion series, so I can check them out first and see what I think.

[medrin]

Trying to figure out what of the things I read recently that are rec-worthy. Hmm...

Tender Morsels by Margo Langan, or as my friend called it, 'the incestuous bear story'. (I told my sister to read it and it starts with an incestuous rape scene, she asked me what kind of book I was trying to get her to read and gleefully told everyone that I recommended weird books. It also has a bear on the cover but he has nothing to do with the incest.) It's a fairytale-ish escape from reality about a girl that has been dealing whit a lot and creates her own escape world. It's also about her two daughters and their story is a retelling of Snow-white and Rose-red.

Cirkeln by Mats Strandberg and Sara Bergmark Elfgren. The next big thing in Swedish youth literature apparently. It's actually a pretty good book.

I recently listened to Margaret Atwood's A Handmaid's Tale. Very good but a bit disturbing and hard to deal with. She has really gone all out in creating the most misogynistic society possible. But it felt like a book one is supposed to have read.

[isis]

The second in the Chalion series has the best strong female character, but they run throughout the series. And it's quite political.

[wintercreek]

Chalice by Robin McKinley - it's a retelling of Beauty and the Beast, but with the story stripped down and rebuilt in interesting ways.

Deep Secret and The Merlin Conspiracy by Diana Wynne Jones - Deep Secret is set mostly at an SFF con, which is awesome, and The Merlin Conspiracy mixes a neighboring universe with one of the characters from Deep Secret. Both feature interesting, flawed characters.

Among Others by Jo Walton - simultaneously the story of a lonely teenage girl who finds solace in reading SFF; and the story of a young woman who can work magic and see fairies, and who has battled to save the world from evil magic. Amazing writing.

The Girl Who Circumnavigated Fairyland in a Ship of Her Own Making by Catherynne Valente - an answer to all the classic fantastic children's stories that left the girls at home or only brought them along to play mother. Has a lovely early 20th century feel while maintaining a tongue-in-cheek sense of humor.

[green_grrl]

Pretty much everything by Ursula LeGuin, Sherri Tepper, Neal Stephenson.

[jesse_the_k]

Three more items which meet the criteria and withstand re-reading, they're so good!

Solitaire by Kelley Eskridge: A UN-like organization selects the best minds of the galactic federation to train them as leaders of tomorrow ... and any more would be spoilers, but oh! such interesting spoilers. In addition to planetary politics and gender roles, lots of interesting stuff about better ways to run businesses and alternative family structures.

The Dispossessed by U K Le Guin: Anarchism vs unfettered capitalism; loners vs gregarious folk; consensus vs dictatorship; plus physics and fascinating landscapes. A Fisherman of the Inland Sea and Four Ways to Forgiveness continue the discussion, with added slavery and how society recovers from that wound.

Lilith's Brood by Octavia Butler: o so crunchy! The very alien aliens have harvested Humans because our biology is fascinating but we clearly don't know how to take care of ourselves or our society. Lilith becomes the human leader, and is generally loathed for it by the other humans. Clearly inspired by the revelation of the immortal cell line HeLa (an excellent companion to this fiction would by The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks by Rebecca Skloot, a scientific biography of that cell line's progenitor).

[feroxargentea]

You could try "Slow River" by Nicola Griffith, near-future SF in which the heroine gets caught up in the exciting world of water treatment plants (really). It's not perfect, but it is interesting.

[luzula]

Oof, not sure I am up to incestous rape. The fairytale elements sound interesting, though.

I read "A Handmaid's Tale" years ago, and it's not something I feel like rereading. There was a great Yuletide story for it this year, though: Hymn.

[luzula]

To clarify: I didn't dislike "A Handmaid's Tale"! It was just heavy reading (but good).

[luzula]

I am definitely getting something by McKinley, and I already decided on getting "Among Others", but it's good to get more votes in their favor!

Huh, I hadn't even heard of those DWJ books, though I've read plenty of others of hers. *makes note of them* She was so prolific!

And the last book sounds really charming.

[luzula]

I love Le Guin so much! Have read most of hers already--she's one of my favorite authors. With Tepper, I enjoyed "Grass", but there have been others of hers I haven't really clicked with. Can't put my finger on why. And hmm, Stephenson. I am ambivalent about him! I enjoyed the geekery of "Cryptonomicon", but at the same time, it's so male-centered, and also I don't agree with his political opinions.

[luzula]

"Solitaire" sounds intriguing! *makes note of it*

I've already read most everything by Le Guin--she's one of my favorite authors. I do feel like rereading some of her books soon, though.

And I've got one of Butler's books as an audiobook that I plan to listen to soon: "Parable of the Sower". But I'll make a note of this one, too.

Thanks for the recs! : )

[luzula]

I have read that one, though it was some time ago and I don't remember the plot. I remember liking it, though. And water treatment plants sound totally interesting to me. : )

[jesse_the_k]

My pleasure. The last two would make interesting reading when you're up in the permanent sunshine in the Arctic. Enjoy!

[jesse_the_k]

And for the gossip factor, Kelley Eskridge is Nicola's partner of decades. In fact here's a charming essay about what it's like to be in a two-writer partnership:

http://nicolagriffith.com/goon.html

Nicola is currently working on a Bildungsroman about Hild, a Saxon saint/queen/it's complicate which she's been researching the hell out of for years.

http://asknicola.blogspot.com/2008/07/hild-and-ammonites.html

I'd so love to see you at WisCon some year!

[medrin]

The incestuous rape and other Bad Things happen in the beginning of the book, and it's not written in such a way that it drags you down as a reader. But it's still, you know, incestuous rape. What I like most about the book is the language and the way it's told. Very fairytale-ish. (There is.. something with the language. At first I though that it was a translation or something. But it's not. But just now when I was looking through it I realised what it was. There is no contractions in the book (I feel very smart for realising this *after* I read the whole thing))

As for the handmaid's tale, yeah, I get you. Once is enough for that book, I don't think I would read it again. But its a good thing to have read it.

[brigantine]

Heeeee! I was gonna recommend those! \o/!!

[malnpudl]

FYI - The entire Vorkosigan series is available free and legal for download in any of several ebook formats, including html. Info in this post.

[brigantine]

"Neverwhere," by Neil Gaiman. He's created a dark, sci-fi/magicky flip-side to our "normal" world, down under the streets, on the rooftops, all our abandoned places. I love his world-building in this. The main character is a young man, but the story revolves around a girl who's in a hell of a lot of trouble, but she refuses to back down, and he must become stronger for her sake, not just his own survival. It's one of my favorite stories. :)

[luzula]

Yeah, that's true--I saw that post when you made it, but had forgotten about it. Thanks for reminding me!

[luzula]

That's actually a Gaiman book I've never gotten around to reading! *notes it down* I bet the library has it, though, so I won't need to buy it.

[luzula]

Awww, that essay was heart-warming. And that Hild book sounds like something I'll be interested in when it comes out.

I'd so love to see you at WisCon some year!

I'd love to! If, you know, I could teleport. I wish at times that I wasn't so environmentally conscious when it came to flying. *facepalm* But I should make it to some con again sooner or later, hopefully when I'm doing something else in the US at the same time so it's not just a weekend trip (I've only been to one con, Bitchin' Party).

[mizface.livejournal.com]

Funny thing... I was literally just thinking about Robin. McKinley. I like her stuff quite a bi. Sunshine is terrific, if you like vampire fic at all. Deerskin was good, but also very dark and has disturbing themes, imo.

Have you read any Charles deLint? I love his urban fantasy, and all of his characters are strong and interesting.

[luzula]

I looooved Sunshine--basically, I fell in love with the main character and her narrative voice. Cool worldbuilding, too. I so want a sequel to it. *makes note of "Deerskin"*

Charles de Lint, hmm. I read one of his a couple of years ago ("Forests of the Heart") and liked it, but was not swept away, if you know what I mean? Maybe I should give him another chance. Any book in particular that you recommend?

[mizface.livejournal.com]

*ponders* If you want to just dip your toes into deLint's writing, Moonlight and Vines is a collection of short stories that I rec to anyone who has never read him.
I'll go home tonight and look over my bookshelf for other ideas for his books.

Oh, and you read Neil Gaiman, so I don't need to rec him, right? If not, Neverwhere and

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*ponders* If you want to just dip your toes into deLint's writing, <i>Moonlight and Vines</i> is a collection of short stories that I rec to anyone who has never read him.
I'll go home tonight and look over my bookshelf for other ideas for his books.

Oh, and you read Neil Gaiman, so I don't need to rec him, right? If not, <i>Neverwhere</i> and <Graveyard Book</i> are two I adore.

Uhm, and Elizabeth Moon's <i>Deed of Paksennarion</i> series is pretty terrific.

[julia-here.livejournal.com]

Ursula K. LeGuin, The Word For World is Forest, Always Coming Home; The Dispossessed has a male protagonist but the book is full of a plethora of non-objectified women; The Left Hand of Darkness is about an ungendered subspecies of humans. Even early, "minor" books like Rocannon's World are gems of world-building and character exploration, and all of them are shaped by political and environmental considerations.

If you can find anything by Frank Herbert outside the Dune series, in many ways the least interesting books he wrote, he's a more interesting writer than he's give credit for. Whipping Star and The Dosadi Experiment are particularly involving.

Finally: any and all John Brunner. Everybody reads Stand on Zanzibar (as well they should), some read Shockwave Rider, but there's reams and realms of what was near-future SF when he wrote them and is now present AU, without sufficient A for comfort.

Julia, Larry Niven's Integral Trees and The Smoke Ring have their points, too.

[luzula]

I am already a huge fan of Le Guin! Have read basically all of hers.

My boyfriend is a Frank Herbert fan and I know he's read books of his other than Dune. Will check which ones he's got.

And hmm, John Brunner--I confess I've never even heard of him. I'll look into him.

Thanks for the recs!

[julia-here.livejournal.com]

Brunner was a poet, and a far red Marxist, which makes him a good balance to the usual run of SF writers of his generation. He also was a bit of a joker in his characterisation, especially. Practically everything of his is out of print, except the two titles I mentioned. I love everything he wrote, although I had to drown one of his books after I read it and had nightmares just keeping it in my apartment.

Julia, the only book I've mindfully destroyed was The Sheep Look Up; it's also the beginning of my inability to tolerate apocafic.

[podfic-lover.livejournal.com]

Two drive-by recs, which I love to re-read time and again:

1.) Green Rider (http://www.kristenbritain.com/books/GreenRider.html) by Kristen Britain

2.) The Ordinary Princess (http://www.amazon.com/Ordinary-Princess-M-Kaye/dp/0142300853) by M.M. Kaye

[luzula]

I had heard of neither of those! Thanks for the recs. : )

[luzula]

Yeah, I've read Gaiman! And the Paksenarrion series is comfort reading for me. : )

[china_shop]

I really enjoyed Graceling by Kristin Cashore, fwiw. (The first couple of chapters had me doubting, but it got better. :-)

[the_antichris.livejournal.com]

Lear's Daughters (http://www.amazon.com/Lears-Daughters-Marjorie-B-Kellogg/dp/0756405343) springs to mind for interesting worldbuilding and environmental stuff. You have to get past a bit of 'bzuh' at the thought that going to another planet is the easiest way to get lithium, but once you accept that, it's great. And if you're reading Jo Walton, have you read Farthing? Interesting female characters and people trying to do the right thing in a horrible WWII AH.

I'm reading the newest Elizabeth Moon (Kings of the North, sequel to Oath of Fealty) and so far it's great. Lots of lovely politics.

[the_antichris.livejournal.com]

John Brunner was a Marxist? Why have I never heard that? BRB, promoting him up my reading queue.

/buttinski

[julia-here.livejournal.com]

Remember when the British Labour Party had some hard core far-left socialists. He was at the farthest left.

[lyr]

I strongly recommend Ian McDonald's River of Gods; it deals with complex political, environmental, and sociological issues, and creates a very detailed, rich, compellingly plausible view of futuristic India that is at once fascinatingly full of culture, history, and technology.

Lois McMaster Bujold's Vorkosigan series, which begins with Warrior's Apprentice also has wonderful world-building, interesting plots, and some of the most strong, delighful characters I've ever read. Bujold's character Cordelia remains one of my favorite female SF&F characters ever.

George R. R. Martin's Song of Ice and Fire series, which begins with Game of Thrones, has great world-building, too. It is fantasy, but not high fantasy---more an authentic Medieval world with some supernatural elements. There are some wonderful characters, an extremely complex plot, and very convoluted politics. However! I must warn you that it is a very authentic Medieval-type world, and as such, truly awful, horrifyingly brutal things happen pretty regularly, often to characters you like.

Also, I have very strong opinions on Robin McKinley. She is one of my favorite writers, and I adore everything she's written. Her fairytales are gorgeous and brilliant and real. I advise starting with The Door in the Hedge, and working your way to Beauty after that. If you're still hungry after you get through her fairytales, her other books are equally delicious, and, in particular, her Hero and the Crown and its sequel The Blue Sword have really awesome, strong female characters.

[luzula]

I will check it out! Thanks for the rec. : )

[luzula]

I'll check out "Leah's Daughters", it sounds intriguing!

I've read one book by Walton before: "Tooth and Claw", the Regency novel with dragons instead of people. I thought it had cool worldbuilding and a cool premise, but it didn't really grab me emotionally. I'll try "Among Others" first, and then maybe go on to her others.

Am about 100 pages into "Oath of Fealty". I am so-so about it so far, because what I really want is The Further Adventures of Paks, you know? But I will give it some more time.

[luzula]

I'll check out "River of Gods", it sounds very interesting!

I've seen the Vorkosigan books mentioned, but never got around to trying them out. *puts on list to check out*

And I read the first and possibly the second (I don't remember) of "Song of Ice and Fire" years ago. I think I liked them fine, but they're not high on my reread list.

I am pretty well convinced to read McKinley now! Everyone is recommending her. : )

[the_antichris.livejournal.com]

I felt the same emotionally about T&C as I do about actual Trollope, which was not much. But the worldbuilding was really cool, and it got me reading the rest of Walton. I found Farthing et seq. much more involving, FWIW.

I know. :( Instead of The Further Adventures of Paks, you get People Talk About How Great Paks Is While She Is Somewhere Else. But I'm enjoying Dorrin and Kieri, especially Dorrin, who's basically playing a deadly serious D&D campaign in her relatives' dungeons.

[luzula]

I found Farthing et seq. much more involving, FWIW.

That's good to hear!

And yeah, Dorrin's just coming into it now, and it seems promising! I always liked her. As for Paks, I'm going to request her for Yuletide again this year. I live in hope. I mean, sure, she pretty much got to the end of her coming-of-age arc in the first trilogy, but I think there's a lot that could be written about still. For example, I'd love to see her older and as a teacher, with a paladin-candidate of her own.